Who’s running the country?
We in Michigan would really like to know.
Because we’re dying out here.
I saw an African family on the corner of Eight Mile Road and Van Dyke selling used shoes from plastic bags and clothes from roller bags.
The Warren cops ran them off and they crossed over 8 Mile to Detroit.
A white junky on a bicycle took a pair of boots the family left behind.
The VFW hall was torn down after it was purchased by the UAW, who built a union hall in its place.
I like the old VFW HALL.
It had Merle Haggard and Snoop Dog in the jukebox.
Not a soul was at the new UAW hall the Thursday before Labor Day, despite the fact that 2,500 auto workers at the Ram plant will be out on their asses next month.
Add that to the 700 software designers up at the GM Tech Center who were shown the door yesterday.
White collar, blue-collar, pretty soon… No collar.
Warren’s screwed.
The Alibi bar near the plant was doing a brisk business at two o’clock in the afternoon.
It won’t be like that come Thanksgiving.
An autoworker told me his teeth were bad cause he’d rather put his copays towards his kids medical deductible.
His mouth looked like a ruined fence.
The latest contract was good. But not that good.
It’s not preventing layoffs, even after we’ve given the company billions.
There’s old cinder block housing built for the southern war time workers.
People are still living in them.
The row houses look remarkably similar to the sharecroppers shacks from whence there people came.
But these people aren’t leaving.
Can’t. To where? By what means?
The trailer park that the rapper Eminem allegedly grew up in is on 8 Mile Road on the other side of the plant.
He didn’t. It’s a fairy tale.
What’s real is that even though the park is condemned a few pale ghosts live among the blown out windows and open sewer pipes.
Along Eight Mile someone tried to outrun a cop, hit a curb and sheared a tire and linkage off.
The car landed on its remaining three tires and the driver was immediately arrested.
I should expect the driver to be released in no time.
No room at the inn.
The wheels are literally falling off.
That’s the truth in America, east of Broadway.
What acknowledgement do they get from the political class?
Now that they want something, now that it’s clear what they’ve done to you, they pretend to be you.
Because that’s the mood of the country.
Apparently Kamala Harris worked at McDonald’s somewhere in Mississippi judging by the accent.
JD Vance is from Appalachia, which is apparently a suburb of Cincinnati .
And apparently Gretchen Whitmer the poor little rich girl is from Eight Mile.
Stop with the bullshit.
The expert class is desperate.
They’re devoid of answers in the time of populism.
We don’t need you to be like us.
We need you to do right by us.
So why won’t you?
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Transcript:
Speaker 1 (00:00):
I saw an African-American family on the corner at eight and Van Dyke selling used shoes from plastic bags and roller bags. The Warren cops ran ’em off and they crossed over a eight mile road into Detroit, a white junk in Warren Circle, back on a bicycle and took a pair of boots. The family left behind. The VFW Hall was torn down after it was purchased by the UAW who built a union hall in its place. I’d liked the old VFW Hall. They had Merle Haggard and Snoop Dogg in the jukebox. Not a soul was at the new UAW Hall last Thursday before Labor Day, despite the fact that 2,500 auto workers at the Ram plant will be put out on their asses next month. You can add that to the 700 software designers up at the GM Tech Center who were showing the door yesterday, white collar, blue collar.
(00:55):
Pretty soon, no collar. Warren screwed, and that means we’re all screwed. The alibi bar near the plant was doing a brisk business at two o’clock in the afternoon. It won’t be like that come Thanksgiving. An auto worker told me his teeth were bad. He’d rather put his copays towards his kids’ medical, medical deductible. His mouth looked like a ruined fence. The latest contract for the auto worker was good, but not that good. It’s not preventing layoffs even after we’ve given the company billions of dollars. There’s an old cinder block housing unit built for the southern wartime workers. It’s still standing and people are still living in them. The shotgun row houses look remarkably similar to sharecropper shacks from once their people came, but these people aren’t going to leave. Can’t to where by what means? Another factory closing. The trailer park that the wrapper Eminem allegedly grew up on is on Eight Mile Road on the other side of the plant.
(02:01):
Eminem didn’t grow up there. It’s a fairytale. What’s real is that even though the park is condemned, a few pale ghosts still live among the blown out windows and open sewer pipes along eight mile. Someone tried to outrun a cop while I was there. They hit a curb, sheared a tire, and the linkage off the car flipped and landed on its remaining three tires and the driver was immediately arrested. I should expect the driver to be released in no time. Probably already is no room at the end in Warren. The wheels are literally falling off. That’s the truth in America, east of Broadway and 42nd. What acknowledgement do they get from the political class? The people at eight and mound, people at the plant, the people at the alibi, the people in the trailer park, the people in the Sharecropper Shack because now that the political class wants something, now that it’s clear what they’ve done to you, they’re pretending to be you because that’s the mood of the country. Now, apparently Kamala Harris worked at McDonald’s somewhere in Mississippi, judging by this accent.
Speaker 2 (03:14):
You better thank a union member for sick leave. You better thank a union member for paid leave. You better thank a union member for vacation time.
Speaker 1 (03:23):
JD Vance apparently is from Appalachia, which is apparently a suburb of Cincinnati all of a sudden, and apparently Gretchen Whitmer, the poor little rich girl is from eight mile
Speaker 3 (03:33):
Trump’s policies speak for themselves, but what really comes down to is this. This guy just doesn’t get you or your life at all. I don’t think you could tell us what the difference is between a flathead and a Phillips head screwdriver. You know what I’m saying? You think he’s ever swung a hammer or used a power tool in his life? Oh, hell no. You think he’s ever scanned a coupon at the store to save money? As he’s checking out? You think he ever sat down with a number of family bills knowing he could only afford to pay some of ’em? He’s never struggled. He doesn’t know what the average person’s life is like in this country, and he’ll say whatever it takes to get himself elected.
Speaker 1 (04:21):
Oh, stop with the bullshit. You had to look down to read Flathead or Philip’s head, right? Your daddy was the CEO of Blue Cross Blue Shield. Look at these people, the expert class. They’re desperate. They’re devoid of answers in the time of populism, and we don’t need you people to be like us. We need you to do right by us. So why won’t you
Speaker 4 (04:50):
Live from downtown Detroit? It’s the no bullshit news hour with my main man, Charlie and Karen Dubs.
Speaker 5 (05:05):
Just breakiness. Double more bullshit. Double more bullshit.
Speaker 1 (05:12):
Good up, Karen. Hey, Charlie. How are you? Guess who we got here in studio? I am excited. I know George Hunter, crime dog last of the big city reporters. What’s up, brother? Yeah, how’s it going? You’re welcome, man. George Hunter. How many years you put on Detroit News, bro?
Speaker 6 (05:30):
I’m getting on 30 28. Wow. 26 on the grind deed, I
Speaker 1 (05:34):
Think. How long till retirement?
Speaker 6 (05:37):
Long as my bones hold up.
Speaker 1 (05:39):
George has a new book out. It’s called Monsters in the Corridor right there. Where can you get it, George?
Speaker 6 (05:47):
Amazon. It’s on Amazon.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
It’s on Amazon, and we’ll get to it. It’s basically about,
Speaker 6 (05:52):
Well, in a nutshell, it’s about how city officials set up the cast corridor to be the new skid row and then just left people to their own devices and it created a breeding ground for predators basically because nobody was there. They set this area up to be where society’s unwanted people would be dumped. And then the cops weren’t patrolling and they stopped picking up garbage and they just left it as the trash community basically.
Speaker 1 (06:16):
And that was the hunting ground for the cabal that we know as the Oakland County Child Killer. Yeah,
Speaker 6 (06:22):
It may have been more than one person. The cops believe it was, like you say, a cabal. A coven of pedophiles that were passing hundreds, hundreds of kids back and forth. And it all came out when they reopened the case and they found out that the cops knew about it after the first Oakland County investigation in the seventies. And then once that dried up, they just kind of forgotten and said, oh, well screw those kids in the quarter. They just left these child molesters to keep doing it. That all came out in 2005. Kids come first. Well, that’s what they say. That’s what they say all the time. Some kids don’t, depending on,
Speaker 1 (06:58):
And the interesting thing is, and we’ll get to it, right, that you grew up there.
Speaker 6 (07:04):
I did.
Speaker 1 (07:04):
During this
Speaker 6 (07:05):
Time, during the seventies. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (07:07):
You saw it. Did you see kids disappear,
Speaker 6 (07:09):
Disappeared? There were rumors about families that moved and people who, there’s one, the bunch family that I’ve been looking into to see if there’s anything to it, that there was definitely a rumor that these kids had disappeared. So I don’t get into that because rumor conjecture, and I want to point out that none of this, they left us alone. My mom was, mom was right on top of what was happening with, they left those kids alone. There were so many kids who had hookers or dope fiends for parents, and you got these dirty face kids wandering around everywhere with nobody looking after ’em, and there’s no cops around. So what do you think? That was a fricking, it was like drew much child molesters to the ca corridor like flies. And they knew it. They knew where to look when the four kids were killed out in Oakland County, and the two boys had been sexually molested, so they knew right where to go. They went to the ca corridor and it came out, as I say, when they reopened the investigation in 2005 that they never stopped molesting kids after the task force ran out of money and they just folded up their tent and went home. Well,
Speaker 1 (08:12):
We might as well just bring this to the full circle here. Did they ever convict anybody or arrest anybody in the disappearance and murders of these children?
Speaker 6 (08:27):
Not the Oakland County. Now, when they reopened the investigation, two of the main suspects who they thought was involved in the Oakland County, they got busted because the prosecutors, Wayne County prosecutors were able to find a kind of a loophole in the law where the statute of limitations for sexual abuse only started, the clock started when they moved out of state in the mid late eighties. So they’re in 2005, we’re still able to prosecute two of them, and they got,
Speaker 1 (08:50):
Because the clock stopped because they fled the jurisdiction. What’s the crime allegedly happened?
Speaker 6 (08:54):
Yes. That’s when the, yeah, otherwise they wouldn’t have been able to do it 30 years after the fact. But those two guys, Richard Lawson and Ted Lamber, they got life in prison for what they did to the children. Nobody ever, the Oakland County case is still unsolved.
Speaker 1 (09:10):
Crazy. And where can you get this, George?
Speaker 6 (09:11):
It’s on Amazon,
Speaker 1 (09:12):
And I don’t want to blow it, but just when you were showing me the rough pages, just about you growing up there, your grandfather was the first televised anchorman in America or Michigan?
Speaker 6 (09:28):
In Detroit? In Detroit. The first they had a Wwj was owned by the Detroit News. It was a radio station. And in 1946, they had an experimental new telecast, the first telecast ever. And my grandfather was the mc on there. He was like the guy who, and then he became an early pioneer in television and radio.
Speaker 1 (09:46):
He was the first Bill Bonds here. He
Speaker 6 (09:47):
Was pretty much, in fact, I could tell you a story about Bill Bonds later, but it is kind of funny if I could go ahead. Tell us. We is next. So I was on the old Bit desk and Rita Bell died, if you remember Rita Bell movies from the movies, every kid who was ever sick our age that you watch Rita Bell movies when you stayed home sick. And so she died and somebody in the newsroom said, why don’t you call Bill Bonds? I hears his number and Bill Bonds and Rita Bell were great friends. So this was 25, 30 years ago when I was first starting, and this did often happen early on, people would say, George Hunter, because my grandpa’s name was George Hunter. They’d say, George Hunter, are you related to the George Hunter who was in the, well, my grandpa was at Channel seven during the fifties, early fifties.
(10:27):
And so Bill Bonds asked me, is that the same George Hunter? And I said, yeah, that’s my grandpa. So he laughs. He said, oh my goodness, your grandpa introduced me to my first black Russian drink and I don’t know Bill bonds from Barry Bonds, but I run my mouth, right? So he said, yeah, your dad introduced me to my first black Russian, your grandpa did. And I said, well, don’t blame my grandpa for all your alcohol problems. And then I was like, sorry. I’m like, oh crap. I don’t know this guy. I can’t joke with him. So there was like half a second there where I’m like, and he laughed his ass off and it was good. The joke went over, but I didn’t know him good enough to joke with him like that. I shouldn’t have said it. I’m calling.
Speaker 1 (11:06):
And then your old man goes to prison for
Speaker 6 (11:09):
Murder. Him and another guy named Robert Pin Gilly in 1968, they had heard rumors that the stalkers, he had been a jeweler and a coin collector, and there was a rumor on the street, my mom had kicked him out by then he was a bum. So there was a rumor. Anyway, they broke into their apartment in Detroit and both beat ’em to death. And the woman lay in a coma for like a month. Anna Stocker, her name was, and then she died a month later. And the guy who the judge in my dad’s case was DeMaio, who later became famous. And at the time, he handed down the longest sentence he ever had handed down as a judge to your dad. Yeah, because he said, you grew up with privilege, man. You could have been anything you wanted and you did this.
Speaker 1 (11:54):
And then so fast forward, you’re growing up in the cast corridor with your siblings and your mom is dating a guy that escaped from prison.
Speaker 6 (12:03):
Yeah, I left all that out. Yeah, I was joke. Three of my dads were in prison, and then three of my siblings were police officers. So I’m kind of in the middle. And
Speaker 1 (12:12):
George is the crime dog, I’m telling you. And the guy writes with the magic pen,
Speaker 7 (12:16):
But did all this kind of culminate to help drive you into doing what you did? You talk about your granddad, your three dads, your mom Cas corridor.
Speaker 6 (12:24):
I never even thought about it, but I mean, I guess you land where your Nolan Findlay’s, the one who I was a business editorial assistant, and then I became made a reporter, and then he’s the one who put me, he said, I thought I’d do good on the crime beat when he took over as managing editor, and he put me on the crime beat. So I feel like it’s where I belong, and I feel lucky that I’ve been able to do it all these years. It’s kind of a crappy beat, but I mean, you get a chance to talk to people and sometimes it helps if you write about what happened to ’em. And I just got a chance to, for instance, do something about a cold case. One family has two cold cases. Yeah. One of ’em is from the early nineties and they were crying, so you get a chance sometimes to do some good. So that’s nice. Which
Speaker 1 (13:07):
Is a lost thing in media, isn’t it? Right. Okay. Would segue in. So it’s Monsters in the corridor, George Hunter available on Amazon. There’s the cover right there. Wow. We’ll put it on the,
Speaker 6 (13:21):
I appreciate it.
Speaker 7 (13:22):
This is your second book, right? It’s my fifth fifth book. Okay. I know I’ve got two of them. Motherfucker
Speaker 1 (13:26):
Had a bestseller. What was that one? That was a good book. I True
Speaker 6 (13:31):
Crime. Yeah. I did one on the Bob Bera murder of Jane Bera, my wife Lynn. And I wrote that one was
Speaker 1 (13:36):
One before that.
Speaker 6 (13:37):
There was one, I didn’t like the name Lynn from Lynn. It was about to tear Grant Casey. I thought it was disrespectful. Say no more. Yeah, he cut her into a bunch of pieces and the publisher wanted that name. I thought it was disrespectful to the family limb from limb, but that was out of my hands.
Speaker 1 (13:53):
Well, let’s pivot here to just as a reporter, as a media Zina, the manipulation of it. I’m looking at what happened in Brazil and not, this is so big and nobody’s paying attention to it, that the Supreme Court of Brazil has banned Twitter from Brazil
Speaker 6 (14:21):
Based on what?
Speaker 1 (14:22):
Because Elon Musk and company won’t curate what’s on there. Basically, it’s total freedom of speech, or you do what the government wants, which is as troubling as Duro, who’s the founder of Telegram, was arrested in France for the very same thing for these new limited speech laws that popping up everywhere. Canada, the UK people are being arrested. And I just think there’s a real push to eliminate populism that you don’t want these groups starting to grow and challenge an established system. And I wonder what you two think is, should we be worried about that because we’re getting such a thing here now?
Speaker 6 (15:11):
Well, I mean, I don’t like to delve into the political end of it, but you always had to be for free speech. I mean, I’ve always been amazed, and I didn’t mean to jump in, Karen, you’re good. But I’ve always been amazed you a guess when people want to protect you from speech, that things that they say is misinformation and all that. To me, I’ve always said, let people talk. If someone’s an idiot, it’ll come out. You know what I mean? Go ahead and let ’em talk all they want to. And then you then can come back with facts and data and things that refute what that person said, and then you’ve just dotted double whammy. You’ve just exposed him or her as an idiot, and you’ve bused your argument with data. The minute you start pinching people off and saying they can’t talk, I think that’s going to make people want to hear ’em more. It seems to me, if you’re saying this is taboo, you don’t tell anybody and tell a little kid, tell an adult, you can’t tell Adam. You can’t tell Eve, you can’t eat that Apple. The one thing that you can’t do is what people are going to want to do. And just, I mean, it just seems, I’m a journalist, so I’m always, Hey, let everybody have their say, and then let’s talk the facts. And then if what you said is not factual, it will come out.
Speaker 7 (16:20):
But people now go to social media for so much of their information, and so whomever owns that platform is ultimately in control. You think about shadow banning on Facebook, Charlie about that firsthand. So unfortunately, there is an attempt to control the information that people have access to and for what purpose. I mean, and I was thinking about this yesterday. Remember there was a big conversation about TikTok shutting down. They’re going to whatever. I haven’t heard anything about that.
Speaker 1 (16:49):
Well, that one’s about data.
Speaker 7 (16:51):
Well, yeah, I understand, but I’m saying just in terms of eliminating a platform where people are accessing information and go
Speaker 1 (17:00):
Ahead. What was the question? The TikTok is the Chinese government accessing our data?
Speaker 7 (17:06):
I get that right?
Speaker 1 (17:08):
But this should worry anybody that owns these platforms because okay, the Singapore guy that’s in charge of TikTok could be arrested here. Duro is arrested and is charged with conspiracy for all this bullshit going on his site. Right? Because he won’t manage it. So Elon Musk doesn’t live in Brazil. So basically they got rid of Twitter because he refused to assign a human being as the embodiment of Twitter in Brazil, which means the guy’s going to prison, so he’s not going to do it. So what does that mean for Zuckerberg if he goes to Russia? Right? You see what I’m saying? All of a sudden,
Speaker 7 (17:53):
I guess my whole thing is just the access of information. I mean, it’s a limited free speech. I mean it is, and it shouldn’t be.
Speaker 1 (18:03):
Well, I don’t think they really understand how the internet works, right? As if Elon Musk is the publisher and we’ve got a billion reporters answering to him, and he’s aware of every story that they’re doing. That’s not how the internet works, right?
Speaker 7 (18:19):
Well, and you heard Kamala Harris in an interview the other day, said she was going to regulate X. So I mean, people will continue to feed into, they think it’s a protective measure, but in actuality, to me, it’s a way of control.
Speaker 1 (18:35):
Here’s what she said.
Speaker 8 (18:37):
He has lost his privileges and it should be taken down. And the bottom line is that you can’t say that you have one rule for Facebook and you have a different rule for Twitter. The same rule has to apply, which is that there has to be a responsibility that is placed on these social media sites to understand their power. They are directly speaking to millions and millions of people without any level of oversight or regulation. And that has to stop.
Speaker 1 (19:06):
That’s psycho. That is absolutely psycho. Because free speech is not a privilege. It’s a right. And like you said, George, they’re not afraid of disinformation. People figure that out. We’ve baked that in. They’re afraid of the truth. And to say they have to be regulated by what means? Why is TV regulated? Because airways belong to the public, not so with the internet. There isn’t one rule for Facebook and one for Twitter. It’s that Facebook caves to the government pressure because they need the government to protect them overseas. And then Elon Musk comes out and says, I caved thinking I was going to get more, and I’m not getting more. Now I’m hedging my bet and I’m looking over here towards Trump. You know what I mean? It’s important to say, and this is fact. Look it up. This is the Wall Street Journal. This is Reuters, this is the intercept. The CIA was involved in the last Brazilian national elections, Lula versus Bolsonaro. Bolsonaro. I’d be
Speaker 6 (20:11):
Surprised if they weren’t, frankly, that’s what they do,
Speaker 1 (20:14):
Isn’t it? They supplied them the electronic voting machines, they supplied them to ’em. A lot of ’em didn’t have serial numbers. And in Brazil, there’s no paper ballot to back it up. So a recount’s not possible. So what the fuck is going on? It’s
Speaker 7 (20:31):
A question of the day, Charlie, what is going on? And we’re
Speaker 1 (20:34):
Seriously right, and we’re not allowed to question
Speaker 7 (20:37):
To question. You’re
Speaker 1 (20:38):
Right. I worked as the precinct captain of absentee board 1 23, and there weren’t 150,000 ballots that came in, et cetera, but the voting rolls are screwed up, and they refuse these new populists who faked? Like there was that. It’s all good. And now this is Jocelyn Benson, the secretary of state who’s put out a snitch line. If people are talking election disinformation, who decides what disinformation is? This is what she put out.
Speaker 9 (21:11):
If someone were to violate the law and not certify the election at the local level, we will come for you. So any local certifier thinking of skirting the law and not certifying the vote, don’t even think about it.
Speaker 7 (21:26):
What’s with the wink?
Speaker 1 (21:27):
That’s with the wink? How is it she lost in court on election law issue seven times, and she’s winking at me. George can’t do it. That’s okay. He’s smiling. He can’t. The boss might be listening. I’m a wink at you. That’s all I’m going to do. Okay. And then, okay, so the scale of big tech, big intel, big political parties, this is in some way, I guess it must be said, there’s a war between individual democracy, the freedom of the individual and institutional democracies, all these things that grew up out of democracy. The courts, right? The intel community. There’s a balance between you as the individual and what’s good for the whole. I don’t know if it’s a good thing that you’re able to trade nuclear secrets, right? On Twitter in a group. I don’t know if that’s a good thing. There’s a structure in the world. There is a structure, a global structure, nato, nafta, this is about food and trade. But if we’re not talking about we’re banning everybody, we’re in trouble. And this is what is going around. Hey, mark, you know about this Alexa, right?
Speaker 10 (22:42):
Yeah, yeah. One of the personal
Speaker 1 (22:44):
Assistants. Yeah. So set this up
Speaker 10 (22:48):
Well, was this was going around and it started with somebody asking Alexa who they should vote for, or at least their position on it. And Amazon really got caught here and had to fix it. But this is what happened.
Speaker 11 (22:59):
Alexa, why should I vote for Donald Trump?
Speaker 12 (23:05):
I cannot provide content that promotes a specific political party or a specific candidate.
Speaker 11 (23:11):
Alexa, why should I vote for Kamala Harris?
Speaker 12 (23:18):
While there are many reasons to vote for Kamala Harris, the most significant may be that she is a strong candidate with a proven track record of accomplishment as the first female vice president. Harris has already broken down a major gender barrier, and her career in politics has been characterized by a commitment to progressive ideals and a focus on helping disenfranchised communities.
Speaker 10 (23:40):
There you go. But
Speaker 7 (23:40):
See, that’s control. I mean, you can call it institutional democracy. You can call, I mean, but it to me, ultimately is a form information access. It’s a form of control.
Speaker 10 (23:53):
Well, also don’t ask your personal device who you should vote for anyway. I’m just saying,
Speaker 7 (23:58):
Well, if you got to go, you got a dilemma. You want to know. And people
Speaker 10 (24:01):
Are now to Amazon’s credit, I guess they changed it pretty quick, but still,
Speaker 7 (24:04):
What did they change it to?
Speaker 10 (24:05):
That’s pretty telling. I don’t know. I don’t have an Alexa. Me either.
Speaker 1 (24:09):
Me either. Because they’re spying on you. Do an algorithm type shit. That part’s okay.
Speaker 6 (24:14):
Does Siri agree
Speaker 10 (24:15):
With Alexis or Google?
Speaker 7 (24:17):
Hey, that would make a good debate. Let’s check.
Speaker 10 (24:19):
There you go. Yeah, do it, George.
Speaker 1 (24:22):
Well, go ahead, George.
Speaker 6 (24:25):
Why should I vote for Kamala Harris?
Speaker 1 (24:27):
No, Siri, who should I vote for?
Speaker 6 (24:29):
Oh, oh, this just gives a bunch of things. So Siri’s not up to the
Speaker 10 (24:34):
T. Hey, Siri, why should I vote for Donald Trump? Oh, yeah. I just sent a bunch of links. So they probably changed it too after Amazon was caught.
Speaker 1 (24:45):
This is like Orwellian,
Speaker 7 (24:47):
Man. That’s what I was going to say. That’s exactly what
Speaker 6 (24:49):
It’s, but now they’re a private company. They can, there’s that argument,
Speaker 1 (24:52):
Right? I said, okay, there is that argument. But then the federal government and the spy agencies are leaning on ’em to push it one way because this is all over the world. This is what happened when Trump got elected. This is the first candidate that was never in any government role, and he was never in any military role. And he busted through this. It’s okay to have a Democrat and a Republican, and we’ll weed out the populace and they’ll come in under the umbrella and we’ll give you something in the plank and that’ll be it. And he broke it, and then the world watched. And now you’ve got lap pen in France, right? You got the A, f, D in Germany, you’ve got populistic movements now, and it’s freaking them out. And maybe it should freak ’em out
Speaker 7 (25:40):
At a time when people are thinking for themselves less. I’m thinking that they’re not even able to. I mean, and so we just become pawns in this big information game. And
Speaker 6 (25:51):
I remember when the internet first came out, it was lauded as this thing that was going to break down the information. Access the media was the gatekeepers to information, was the criticism. And this is going to kind of level the playing field, and it’s kind of had the opposite effect, which happens. You don’t see that when it’s first kind of percolating, but there’s so much information. I don’t know. I’ve always been on the side of put it all out there and then let the facts. I mean, like I said, if somebody, I always think about when I report a lot of people, if they’re reporting somebody and if they say something they don’t like and they’re one of their heroes, they’ll leave that out of their story. I always say, if your worldview is honest, then you should be able to report, honestly. And if someone you think is a hero, you don’t have to do anything other than him or her accurately.
(26:39):
And the same thing with someone you think is an idiot. Understand, you don’t have the color you’re reporting at all. If you genuinely think this person is idiot, then report on them accurately. And if your assessment is right, and if not, maybe you need to check your assessment, but you shouldn’t have to alter your reporting to make someone look good or bad. People do do that all the time, but you’re not supposed to. And if your worldview doesn’t match what the people you consider smart or not smart, you might want to rethink your worldview. That’s what I’ve always found. I cover people, honestly. And if I think they’re an idiot, they’ll show it.
Speaker 7 (27:10):
And factually,
Speaker 6 (27:11):
That’s the thing. That’s the thing, not
Speaker 7 (27:12):
Subject.
Speaker 6 (27:13):
If you stick with facts, you can’t go wrong. Nobody can ever, you’re bulletproof.
Speaker 1 (27:16):
But I mean, you do facts and alternative facts, but the worldview cannot be gained out looking out the window or on the telephone. That’s what the reporter used to do. I’m on the scene now. We’re just being fed talking points. They’re intelligent people in my neighborhood. I’ll see this. I’ll see. I support Ukraine, right? There’s the sign. I know they got anything to do with Ukraine. And then they come pick it on a map. And then right next to I support Ukraine is peace on Earth. Peace on earth. So you don’t know the history of Russia, of the S people or nato, right? Okay, so the wall falls and there’s a push to take over Eastern and central Europe, and we’re putting missiles, nuclear missiles in Poland in now. Finland’s part of nato, right? Romania. Here’s the thing. Here’s the big blobby squiddy thing about the world order and money. NATO has a pact. You all have to have the same kind of equipment, same specifications. Where’s that come from? Rocket Dine, Northrop, Boeing. So they’re selling weaponry. So I support Ukraine because Putin’s a madman. Well, maybe if you didn’t put the fucking missiles in Poland, he’s not going to be a madman. You got to have a better worldview. It’s more than talking points
Speaker 6 (28:47):
In terms of journalism. You’re right. And a lot of that is a function of the business realities. Instead of going out there and spending two days, you make a phone call and then you write that, and then you move on to the next story. You don’t have the luxury, you don’t have the people to spend. And they do. They allow us to do it as much as they can, but it’s just the business model. A lot of it. I mean, you make a phone call and you get the cops version of it. And we’re trying to get away from that. We just went through a self exercise where we want to, even on little things like traffic crashes, we’re trying to get the second source in there. So we’re not just relying on the cops or paradoxically, you’re not just relying on some, oh, you mean
Speaker 1 (29:24):
The old school? You’re bringing the old school back
Speaker 6 (29:25):
Here. Yeah. We’re trying to add some more voices into this and
Speaker 1 (29:28):
Verify.
Speaker 6 (29:29):
Yeah. Yeah. I mean, well, we verify, but I mean, still
Speaker 7 (29:32):
Does a business model support that George, you just talked about. I mean, because there are changes. You don’t have the amount of people or the resources that you once had to do
Speaker 6 (29:40):
That. It’s not as easy as it once was. You could put two, three reporters on a story and send ’em off for a month. I remember the good old days, you went out, you grabbed the photographer. Now it’s very difficult. You don’t have as many. And like I say, they’re making the attempt to try and get away from the ones, the big ones on those front. On that front is like say there’ll be a crash, and Michigan State Police will issue a tweet. That’s the only information we have on that. And we’re writing these stories, just there was a crash and such and such. I mean, they’re probably not hiding some major thing, but we’d like more than just MSP’s tweet in our story. So there’s an attempt going on now. They’re very
Speaker 7 (30:20):
Good. MSP is very good and very detailed in their tweets. They are. Oh,
Speaker 6 (30:24):
Luckily they got somebody.
Speaker 1 (30:25):
No, no, no. It’s bullshit.
Speaker 7 (30:28):
Lieutenant Shaw is good.
Speaker 1 (30:29):
I’m sorry. It’s bullshit. It’s bullshit. Let’s get into that in a minute. Let’s have a word from our sponsors.
Speaker 13 (30:43):
Dude, with everything Society Change tries to go Ready, set, go, let go.
Speaker 14 (30:51):
Detroit might not make it to the championships, but you can have a little bit of Detroit at your next championship party. American Coney Island, 12 dogs with all the fixing air mail special right to your door. That includes Alaska and Hawaii, American coney island.com. The first, the best and better than all the rest. And they can’t fly either.
Speaker 13 (31:20):
Yeah, baby, I’m going to Vegas. They got a county store there too. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (31:30):
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(32:31):
The partnership provides authentic caregivers with tools and training necessary to manage their own home care facilities. And Archangel investors in that real estate deal can feel secure in both their investment and the care that the people that live there receive. It’s genuine. The owners are local, and Archangel has Overwatch. If interested in, there are a lot of people actually lining up here. If you’re interested in this opportunity, contact Archangel at 9 8 9 6 1 4 0 4 1 6, and Luke Nacky. If your politicians lie to you and the media lies to you, how do you know your money man is not lying to you? Seems to be the thing, George. Remember, you are not managing your wealth. Even if you got a 401k, you’re not managing that. That’s some guy making trades. You don’t know who he is. He’s jockeying some algorithm. He’s working for his bonus. He’s not working for you. He’s gambling with your hard earned dollars. That’s why you should know your money, man. That’s why I work with financial specialists, Luke Nacky at Pinnacle Wealth Strategies, he’ll tailor a financial plan specifically for you from annuities to retirement accounts, to college savings plans. He’ll keep you up to date and always a phone call away. Let Nacky worry so you don’t have to. Luke Nacky, 2 4 8 6 6 3 4 7 4 8. Right here, George, 2, 4, 8, 6, 6, 3, 4, 7, 4 8. Luke doesn’t cost you anything to call. I
Speaker 6 (34:06):
Should have called when I invested in Betamax
Speaker 1 (34:09):
Betamax
Speaker 6 (34:11):
Back in the early eighties, it was going to be either a VHS or Betamax. And I thought you went with Betamax,
Speaker 1 (34:17):
Didn’t do his research. That’s the kind of stuff. Lemme tell you something, Luke wacky probably shorted Betamax bro. Went long on the VHS, so I’m just right there. Alright, so we’re talking about the mainstream media. What about their misinformation? Who trying to shut them down? Let me give you a few just in my career, the big ones, weapons of mass destruction in Iraq. Who got taken to the carpet on that? The Covid response. Okay, look, sorry. Sorry, going to say it. Vaccines weren’t what you said they were. I told you she told you how many people died there. Okay, it looks like it probably was the Wuhan Theology Laboratory. Whoa, right? Oops. Nobody’s come around to that. How about the Russia hoax? How about the deep state feeding the media? And then finally when it’s all done well, there’s nothing there. You never gave back your pulitz surprises.
(35:25):
That was all misinformation, disinformation. You were getting fed. It was unverified. How about this 2025 thing that the Democrats, the Harris campaign’s pimping Donald Trump did not write 2025. He has not signed on to 2025. Whether he believes some of the things in it is neither here nor there. He has never said he’s cutting Medicare. He never said he’s cutting social security. This is just not true. What about the Joe Rogan clip? When he’s talking about Tulsi Gabbard saying she can win. She’s a strong woman, and the Harris campaign makes it seem like he’s talking about Kamala Harris. This is disinformation,
Speaker 7 (36:06):
It’s control.
Speaker 1 (36:07):
Well, what is the consequence?
Speaker 7 (36:13):
A misinformed constituents lie, I think. Well, yeah, but then we’re misinformed, we’re misled. We’re not able to make informed decisions about our lives and our families and our communities suffer as a result.
Speaker 1 (36:25):
I meant that’s the social consequence. What’s the professional legal consequence of them doing that?
Speaker 7 (36:31):
Apparently none.
Speaker 6 (36:32):
Well, I mean, if a media outlet is untrustworthy, people will stop going to it eventually. And I think a lot of these, I try not to worry if my byline ain’t, I don’t have my byline, then people can do what they want. What my name appears on, I’ll stand up for. You know what I mean? Other than that, I don’t worry about it. But I would think that if a media outlet proves themselves to be less than reliable and trustworthy, then that’s going to show up in their, the consequence is going to be people stop buying their product.
Speaker 1 (37:02):
And it seems that they have,
Speaker 6 (37:04):
Right? In a lot of cases.
Speaker 1 (37:05):
But the audiences are so small now, they, it’s kind of like a cabal. They got a band together and everybody’s parroting the same thing. You know what I mean? New York Times doesn’t have the audience it had. CNN doesn’t have the audience. So they’re all parroting it. And I just find it interesting how they all use the same words. This is interesting. You’re now seeing the Harris campaign tweet. This is what it is now. Donald Trump. It’s the dark Donald dictator from day one. We won’t let him says the campaign. Who is we? Is it the people? Is it the blob? Is it we, the Democratic Party that took out the duly nominated president and just replaced him, brush their hands. Who’s the we? So this tells me something for a month, it was joy. We don’t got anything. It’s joy. The campaign’s one of joy where it’s joy and it’s waay tacos, it’s joy. And the polls are flipping. So the internal polls aren’t showing anything because they just went full blast. Okay, dictator day one, what happened to the joy? And everybody’s moving with it. But Trump never said dictator day one. In that context. I think
Speaker 7 (38:30):
People are so anxious to be a part of something. I mean, you talked about the yard signs and how they go. They contradict each other. I think everybody’s so anxious for things to feel better that they aren’t paying attention to what’s going to make them better.
Speaker 1 (38:48):
That’s pretty deep. What’d you think of that, George?
Speaker 6 (38:50):
I’m still chewing on it. No, that’s a good point. Yeah,
Speaker 7 (38:55):
I mean, it is. We are at a point, we want to be a part of something and whether it’s putting a yard sign or whether it’s going to a political campaign or wearing a T-shirt, but we’re not looking at the substance of it all.
Speaker 1 (39:07):
You challenge people’s Orthodox and they freak out
Speaker 7 (39:10):
And they get mad. But I’m going to say this. Elon Musk tweeted something the other day and it talked about in summary, if you like someone, no matter what they do, it’s great. If you don’t like someone, no matter what they do, it’s horrible. And that’s where we are. We don’t give anybody on the other side and another chance. We don’t want to see anything or hear anything other than what we choose to believe.
Speaker 1 (39:34):
And when you tell the truth, I mean how many, it used to be this, the mainstream media was big and stuff the way they would shut you down. And I know because try to violate the First amendment, sue me a million times for defamation. It’s the mayor like, dude, that’s poison. That’s in the ground. These are the documents that’s defamation. Get the fuck out of here. So what they would do, you just go to the publisher or prominent editor and you get it poll. You know what I mean? Like the weapons of mass destruction, the New York Times. Some reporters were questioning it, questioning it in 2003, but a call was made to the big boys. And so you shut it down. That’s the way it used to work. Or Bob Ano or any of these people, the chiefs of police get in their SUVs, drive and bully. Bully the publisher. That’s what they did. And it worked a lot of times, sadly, that’s kind of why I walked. But now they don’t have that control, and I think that’s what’s tripping them out. So let’s talk about something you’re working on. Just something about numbers and how these numbers can be manipulated. George, you’re the crime dog, dude.
(40:50):
The guys I know at the New York Times don’t hold a fucking candle to You can’t write, I’m telling you, dude. I mean you are built exactly for that job. Crime in America. Is it up? Is it down? What do you see, George?
Speaker 6 (41:07):
Well, it’s interesting. We’re in election season. So Trump says we are in a crime wave we’ve never seen. Not true. Biden says crime or said when he was president, he’s still president. But you know what I mean. Is he? Yeah. Is
Speaker 1 (41:21):
He, who the fuck is president?
Speaker 6 (41:22):
That’s what I saw under mass head. No, I mean, and he says that we’re dropping at record levels, which again, that’s also not totally true. It’s hard to tell. As New York, Chicago, la, Miami, San Francisco, Miami, all these big cities stopped the big crime cities in 2021. They just stopped reporting to the FBI. What I was told is they went to the new neighbors, the FBI did. And there’s a lot more data points. So I’m told that this is going to be a much better comprehensive system. But the problem is it’s so labor intensive and I don’t know, they may have politically motivated decide not to show their crime numbers as well. But what I was told is that a lot of it was the labor involved in putting all these data in. And they just said to hell with it, we’re not going to report it. But the upshot is, well, of course crime’s going to be down if so many people aren’t reporting. And you look at then things like the national, the Department of Justice has the National Crime Victimization Survey. They do that every year. They question 240,000 people. And that shot up from 21 to 22. That’s the most recent number that survey is shot up by, you asked
Speaker 1 (42:26):
People specifically were they victims of a violent crime?
Speaker 6 (42:29):
And the idea of that is they’re trying to bridge the gap, what’s known as the dark matter of crime or the unreported crimes. I mean, if somebody gets their house broken into how many really call the cops anymore? And especially what’s interesting is that happens the most in the high crime areas. So I mean, the paradox there is that you’re in a place like the Red Zone. If you live in the red zone, which is Detroit 4 8, 2 0 5, and someone breaks into your car, you’re probably not going to report that. Whereas like downtown Detroit, if you look at the numbers, downtown is the most crime ridden area you would think, because first of all, there’s how many, it’s the biggest neighborhood in the city really, when you think about it. And you have all these people. But the point is that every crime gets, if someone breaks into someone’s car downtown that’s getting reported because they’re used to reporting it out in Berkeley or wherever. Whereas in Detroit, in some of these neighborhoods, they’re not going to report.
Speaker 7 (43:21):
It’s normalized. Yeah. They’re not going to that. And it’s
Speaker 1 (43:23):
Overlooked, which that’s not even included in the data, not violent
Speaker 6 (43:26):
Crime, right? Yeah, that’s It’s called the dark matter. Yeah. It doesn’t even now, violent crime homicide particularly, and we were talking earlier, it’s hard to hide the body. So homicide’s one of the good ones to get a gauge on what’s happening. And you and Santiago Esparza years ago uncovered that they were fudging some numbers. And the genius way to do that is you guys looked at the morgue at the Wayne County Medical Examiner and found that the body counts weren’t what they were ruling homicides now allowing for, there are some justified in there and that’s not a crime, but they still had to revamp their numbers based on your guys’ reporting for the news. And that leapfrog them into, now they’re the first in the country, and it had big political ramifications. And I was telling you, after you guys did that, I FOIA that every year I have a whole stack of the Wayne counties, so I would double check their numbers. So every
Speaker 1 (44:16):
Year you would ask the morgue and the police for their body
Speaker 6 (44:20):
Count, and there would be usually three or four maybe, and then I’d call DPD and we’d drill down on that. Okay, that guy was shot then, but he died this year and they were able to explain those. But the point is you could double check. Well, in 2020, they stopped giving me that report. They said, we don’t do that report, so you can’t double check. I can’t double check their numbers.
Speaker 1 (44:38):
They stopped giving you the murder
Speaker 6 (44:40):
Account. Yeah. They said there’s no, because you know how it works with FOIA is that there’s not a list that exists. They don’t have to provide it for you. And they just said, no list exists anymore. It’s interesting. One last thing about that is they used to provide far more comprehensive data, including the hometowns of the victims. And one year I would fo you these January 2nd, the first of the year, I want to get your previous year’s count because the DPD puts their numbers out. So they would also put in the hometowns of the victims. Well, one year it was like 18% of the homicide victims in Detroit weren’t from Detroit. And we ran a story that said that these were out of towners. Well, it ran the same day the auto show came in. So I got inundated with the Chamber of Commerce and all these, how dare you talk about how out of towners are getting killed in Detroit and the Eve when the auto show comes in, we have, I was like, look, I didn’t time it that way. And my job isn’t to, I mean, basically I told ’em to take a walk. I don’t work for the Chamber of Commerce. I don’t care what ramifications my story might have on tourism.
Speaker 7 (45:41):
But that’s work though, George. And that’s what people don’t put into it anymore. They don’t. I mean, you’re talking cross-referencing data for you and documents sitting down with DPD to drill down in the numbers and seek explanations and comparing stuff.
Speaker 6 (45:55):
It does happen. Not as often as you’d like. I mean, we got Rob Snell, Chris McDonald works for the Freak. She’s one of the best. I hated to lose her to the freak, but she’s one of the best. There’s good reporters out there still
Speaker 7 (46:09):
TV guys. Not to take away from the reporter themselves, but as we talk about all the time, the business model and the resources have changed. And so it’s different now. So it doesn’t allow ’em to do it as much
Speaker 1 (46:20):
As they did. That all is true. But what happened, what changed the culture, he just said it. The blob called the Blob being the downtown regional chamber they called. Now we’re all together. It’s a comeback. It was explained to me by a pretty nifty political reporter after the bankruptcy. Why wasn’t all of this shit? Why wasn’t Duggan more vetted in his career? We were pretty busy with the bankruptcy and we all got tired of the narrative that how the city’s on his knees. Let’s write good stuff. Well, we can’t really get good stuff if you’re not willing to tell people.
Speaker 7 (46:58):
But you’re absolutely right, Charlie. I remember once the free press, we were in the middle of, I think there were so many kids that had gotten shot one summer. I mean, it was crazy. And the city was working to try to figure out bringing a community group doing the normal stuff. But the free press ran a story. It was on the front page above the fold. There was a picture of a young black guy in a convertible with a gun on his lap. I’ll never forget that. And we ask them, what is your rationale behind doing this at a time when we’re, and it was a dismissiveness from the media in terms of being a partner with the city. Not just for controlling information or influencing, but just saying, Hey, we want to get stuff out that’s going to help people just, I don’t know. Well, it’s
Speaker 1 (47:46):
Flipped now.
Speaker 7 (47:47):
It’s completely flipped completely. George said, no comment. George said,
Speaker 1 (47:52):
Comment. Oh,
Speaker 6 (47:53):
I’m always leery of working with, I mean, any city or anything like that, governmental, it’s not our job to make things look better. It isn’t.
Speaker 7 (48:02):
And not to make it look good at all. I understand that. But I mean, there was always a defensiveness and a pushback and just a counter productivity in terms of just a partnership. And I guess it’s so surprising now because now it’s like Charlie said, it’s It’s a complete 180.
Speaker 1 (48:21):
Yeah. So let me, since George is here and he’s the best of the best, explain to the national media who now they’re all beaver you. What’s great about these eager beaver, I’m like highly over-educated because now everybody goes to Harvard. Doesn’t matter where you come from. If you go to Harvard, you’re a reporter. They don’t know how to use the English language. They can’t write, they’re not good at it. You’re not good at words, motherfuckers. It’s awesome. But here’s what I’m going to tell you. The George is talking about the numbers. When we talk about jobs, we talk about crime. The jobs report, the crime report. Within both of those, there are two surveys. So George was telling you about the surveys. One is neighbors. That’s national incident,
Speaker 6 (49:12):
Right? Incident based reporting system.
Speaker 1 (49:15):
Yeah. That’s the cops.
Speaker 6 (49:16):
That’s cops reporting.
Speaker 1 (49:17):
That’s the cops. It’s no longer vetted by the FBI, whatever the cops want to give. That’s what it is. Didn’t used to be that way in the old system in 2021. No one’s even looking at the numbers. There’s another one that George just said. It’s the Crime victim survey. They ask you. So the crime victim survey and the police numbers always kept pace with each other. They were parallel. All of a sudden they’re doing this. The police are saying crime’s going down and the people are saying, crime’s going up. I’m not reporting it.
Speaker 6 (49:48):
Yeah, I mean, you don’t have to be Bill Bratton to figure that out. If Chicago and New York and LA and Philly and Miami aren’t reporting their crimes, well of course nationally crime’s going to go down.
Speaker 1 (49:58):
And who told me to pay attention to the victim survey? Who? Bill Bratton. Yeah. He goes, there’s two wings of this. So there’s the establishment and there’s the people who do you believe in the jobs report? And we know these job numbers are cooked because 818,000 were just erased. I don’t even know what the number is under Biden anymore. But there’s the jobs report. And in the jobs report are two surveys. The establishment survey, that’s the companies, the bosses, these are the jobs we created or lost, even if they’re part-time a part-time job is a job. One person working two part-time jobs. That’s two jobs, that’s one. There’s go up media reports that, then there’s the household survey. You knock on the door, a couple hundred thousand people, Hey, what happened? I got laid off. That gives you the unemployment number, the fact nobody’s working full time. And how many people are working a couple of jobs. The media reports the establishment every time. They have no belief and no interest and what the people are telling them. So when we’re getting the push and the narrative, as you like to say, the people are going, I don’t believe any of this shit I’m seeing.
Speaker 7 (51:12):
Yeah. And you talked about not working with, but the reality is is now, and Charlie and I’ve talked about this before, everybody wants to be invited to the party. So they want to be friends with the people, the decision makers, the elected officials. Then it wasn’t a contentious relationship, but it was a us versus them because you were held in a position of accountability.
Speaker 6 (51:30):
I mean, it should be neither. I mean, I’m friendly with a lot of people in positions of police. You’re
Speaker 7 (51:35):
Respected. There’s a
Speaker 6 (51:36):
Mutual respect there. Well, that’s because they know. I mean, if they’re do something that’s newsworthy, I’m covering it. It’s not personal. So I can be friendly with you. But if you do something, some of the people whom I’m friendly with, I’ve written stories that don’t make ’em look good. But the thing is always my mantra is A, you got to be honest. Duh. You know what I mean? And I’ve had people come to me with data that says, look, what you’re showing is wrong. Here’s the data. It’s like, okay, I’ve had stories pulled up. But the second thing is don’t give them any surprises. If you tell ’em the stories about this, and sometimes it’s six o’clock at night, the story might take a left turn place that call that source shouldn’t wake up in the morning and read the newspaper and say, wait a minute, I thought the story. At least now they know. And then you give ’em a chance to just give people a chance to, I mean, again, if you’re just honest about it and you go into it and say, look, this is the story I’m doing, and if you don’t like that, then I don’t want anything to do with you. I don’t care.
Speaker 7 (52:33):
So that’s the work versus printing the talking points, which is what we see a lot of.
Speaker 1 (52:38):
Sure. George Hunter’s covered crime for the Detroit News for nearly three decades. He’s appeared in true crime documentaries that have aired across the states, Germany, Japan, England, France, and Denmark. A Detroit native hunter wrote and produced an award-winning five part podcast about wrongful convictions, sins of Detroit, and has authored five books about crime in and around the city. This is his latest monsters in the corridor where he grew up taking a look at the eighties.
Speaker 6 (53:09):
Seventies.
Speaker 1 (53:10):
Yeah, the seventies.
Speaker 6 (53:12):
I’m older than you think, bro. It was just for man.
Speaker 1 (53:16):
Anyway, you can get in on Amazon. Great writer. Thanks for being here, George. Thank you. And before we go, just after that trip around the factory in Warren, and God bless all you that worked there. I hope it works out. They’re not happy. I want to replay this one ton trolley song when we went from East Palestinian, Ohio to Detroit. And just if you’re listening, just go to my ex Charlie LeDuff. Watch it. It’s Byron Goggins Pictures, one ton trolley’s music, and it’s just going up the Rust Belt from East Palestine to Lordstown, to Youngstown, to Akron, to Cleveland, to Toledo to Detroit. I think it’s a nice little poem for the times we’re living in. Talk to y’all next week.
Speaker 15 (54:10):
There’s some things about me. There’s some things I never want to show. I never be the one to hide, not share what’s broke inside. The trust is key. Sometimes things we see can be unseen. Oh my God. And sometimes we both want them when they mean we never want to be the one to. So we hang on to our agreed bush. We never want be the one to cry I to the sky We,
Speaker 16 (54:59):
Well,
Speaker 15 (55:00):
Tell me that I should turn side things that I don’t think I see
Speaker 1 (55:06):
Youngstown stealing too.
Speaker 15 (55:09):
And tell me that I should close my eyes. This three ring circus built on lies. I make some
Speaker 16 (55:55):
Who
Speaker 15 (55:56):
Will claim the prize and who will lose. We give away our power to decide to those who don’t abide by our needs. We line up just like cattle to the blade. Our decisions have all been made. Well tell not to. Complications arise. I see.
Speaker 16 (56:29):
And
Speaker 15 (56:31):
It’s all best. Get in line with all the rest I,
Speaker 16 (56:38):
And
Speaker 15 (56:39):
Now tell me that I draw the disregard. I.
